AT&T U-verse → Will AT&T ever see super vectoring?

Been traveling around Germany for a few weeks and Deutsche Telekom just released super vectoring for VDSL. 250/40 over bonded pair. For the best part of the last few years most people hve been getting 100/20 single pair. I wonder if AT&T will ever role this out. Thoughts?

Doubtful considering the directions they are going.

Not if they have to spend money!

As far as I am aware, AT&T is not doing anything at all in the way of upgrades on their copper network. Their sole upgrade path is through their extensive fibre roll-out they are currently working on.

Considering how many ‘F’ cards are still in service, it’s very doubtful..

Does AT&T even have regular vectoring deployed?

The only situation that I’d expect to see something like this deployed is an apartment building in which upgrading the copper to replace with fiber is difficult (an uncooperative landlord, cables in hard-to-reach areas, etc. ), and it’s cheaper than deploying 5G fixed wireless.

AT&T has invested in g.fast technology, which also makes the above speeds possible.

Read up on it here: »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G.fast

They are currently only deploying it in multi-dwelling units where replacing copper with fiber requires major structural damage, such as ripping open walls and whatnot....

AT&T's current strategy for urban areas (say areas that now have U-Verse VDSL, not areas that are still on DSL) is to deploy fiber optic networks.... but it will be 2025 or later before most of the network is upgraded.

As to Supervectoring, here is an interesting article that explains why it would work for Europe, but not so much for many areas in North America:

»www.adtran.com/index.php ··· -america

The biggest issue is really cost vs reward. In many European cities when they built homes in the 1950s through 1980s, they built row houses with 2 or 3 floors going up.... offering the same space inside as an average American house, but without the yard space. In the US they built single story houses by the millions during that same time period, on lots that had yard on all sides.

In short, a 500m long street in say.... Germany may have 30 houses on each side for 60 houses.... and a DSL cabinet on one end of the street.

In the US, that same 500m would have..... 12 houses on each side, single story, 24 in total. So the cost per house would be higher, and the return lower.

On the flip side, upgrading physical cables on that same street in Germany would likely mean a lot of digging, where in the USA many of these neighborhoods still have utilities provided by poles. And running new fiber cable across poles is a lot cheaper than digging up sidewalks.

So an overall strategy of deploying fiber as opposed to trying to make copper work better is probably a better plan.

T mobile 5g and Verizon 5g networks are going donate over att dsl networks.

Donate?

Current 4G LTE technologies already dominate over any DSL from any company. :P DSL is pretty much limited to 6 Mbps or so..... on my phone I can get 15-20 Mbps in a busy city with many phones, and I can get close to 80 Mbps on a Sunday morning at my home.....

Wireless technologies are going to help close the gap between neglected rural communities and urban high speed connections though, I definitely think they will play a part.

As far as calling out a "your brand sucks and my brand is better! #mybrand4life" kind of claim.... nah. All cell phone networks equally suck. :P On Verizon I can't even make a phone call and use data at the same time..... although that might have changed recently.

VDSL2 does much faster than 6 mbps, though it still pales in comparison to cable .

As far as simultaneous voice and data, Verizon has had it for years. You just have to have a phone capable of VoLTE or “HD Voice”, or an older phone with dual radios.

Maybe check your settings or enable HD voice if it’s still not working.

Sorry about the spelling. 5g networks are way faster than adsl networks. Att is testing its fixed 5g wireless home internet service in Indiana.»www.google.com/amp/s/www ··· indiana/ Maybe it will replace its Adsl service.

Yes. The person however said DSL, not VDSL, not VDSL2, not ADSL. Yeah, they rolled that out in 2016. But don't be mistaken: It isn't "voice and data at the same time" as in the traditional sense, like GSM based networks were already able to do in the late 1990s, they simply moved voice to voip over internet data. They still cannot, as of today, use CDMA based communication to make a phone call *and* use e.g. 3G or 4G data at the same time.

Example: If you go to Mexico..... VoLTE/HDVoice doesn't work, and calls go across CDMA again..... which means: NO data during the call. Unless the data is wifi.....

In a nutshell, they just use a workaround to get around a CDMA design flaw. But it will become mostly irrelevant anyways with all voice at some point moving to tcp/ip based networks.

I mean ADSL, basically copper to home service.

What does this notation mean? Not sure if it's a typo, an emoticon, or something else. Thanks.

It's a tongue-out smiley. I doesn't work in all forums though....



Edit: Apparently you have to use a SMALL p, not a capitalized P.

Not correct either

VoLTE is a GSM path standard, and CDMA will be completely gone next year. In fact, my Pixel 2 XL has an option to operate in LTE/GSM only and works fine on Verizon in that fashion. If i go anywhere without LTE it just says "No Service" as it does not even bother to look for CDMA/EvDO

Verizon even has interconnect agreements with AT&T for HD VoLTE

Also, I roam in Mexico on Telcel HSPA/LTE a few times each month, and it's full on HSPA for calls, so it does have simultaneous voice/data (same up in Canada on Bell/Rogers/Telus, and overseas). I've not had CDMA roaming in a few years.

VoLTE roaming will come with time, it's just that Verizon cannot guarantee QoS for VoLTE packets on other carriers when they're roaming, but HSPA is plenty suitable when roaming for voice/data at the present time as it still does it simultaneously

ADSL2, VDSL, and G.fast are also copper to home, just much much faster than 6 Mbps.

There’s even (long range) Ethernet over Copper or Ethernet in the Last/First Mile, but it’s basically a better performing (and cheaper) alternative to T1 lines, although so far I’ve only seen the reseller DSL Extreme (and presumably MegaPath/Speakeasy) offering it.

Well.... so in 2016 or so, Verizon was finally able to do what AT&T was able to do when the first GPRS data connections were established in the 1990s. (Voice/Data at the same time!)

About time.

I remember using a GPRS connection as a modem on my laptop, and using a RDP connection AND be on a conference call at the same time in 2003 or so..... using a blackberry (remember those?) and a USB cable. It was slow.... but RDP worked surprisingly well!

But... that was on an AT&T connection, not Verizon. Verizon may have made some changes regarding that in recent years.... 2016 or later maybe? But they sure took their time.

Most national GSM carriers did not support simultaneous voice and data until the deployment of HSPA+.
Put any T-Mobile phone in "2G" EDGE mode and you lose all data connectivity until the call is completed.

One of Verizons first LTE devices, the HTC Thunderbolt, supported simultaneous voice and data by the means of dual radio connectivity..

Of course in 2014, when VoLTE was switched on the issue went away for most.

Does 5G OFFICIALLY exist yet .... or are these companies packaging a FAKE. i thought 5G "hardware" isn't even available yet ... if the sec has even been released/finalized ....

This entire 5G product is a FRAUD perpetrated upon the consumer.
Even when you hear about "5G Fixed Wireless" when you consider what it will take to get it to work it's a ridiculous concept compared to FTTH.
With all cantennas which require electric power, to the issues of maintenance for all of them and of course interference from buildings and topography...not to mention the usual problems with wireless which include congestion and latency....a complete joke of a concept. To think that the big providers could have ALREADY built out a PROVEN product with a much lesser amount of required maintenance and longevity....FTTH.

I couldn't agree more. The same claims they made for 3g, 4g, 4G LTE there making for "5g" and it's just more of the same marketing with the same drawbacks there are now. Fiber is the future and should be embraced

5G is nothing but a marketing name. The average public doesn't care what "generation" their fixed wireless internet is or what exact technology is used to provide it. As long as it might be faster than the aging DSL copper lines they have now, they are happy as a pig in the mud.

As far as whether the name 5G is a fraud or the technology doesn't do what the telco's promised it would do.... are there actually people that CARE about that? If there is a wireless technology that might help people get more speed than the 3 Mbps DSL lines they have now..... by all means, bring it on in large quantities!

Spot on! I don't think the average public knows the difference between DSL, Cable, and (my favorite) 'WiFi'... Most cell customers know if their call drops or if Facebook is not loading, but that is about it...

Exactly and when I recall AT&T first hacking 3G to kind of work over their existing GSM network in 2006-2007 (which btw at&t was not able to do GSM at all until 2003 when the original AT&T wireless - not this cingular rebadge we have now- launched "GSM America") and HSPA itself started a wide rollout around 2006/2007

Cingular (which is the AT&T we all know now) was TDMA at the time, everywhere except Cali which PacBell had GSM/GPRS on PCS - which the Cali Network is now T-Mobile as when Cingular bought AT&T Wireless they had to give Cali to T-Mobile per the original network sharing agreement

The giving the Cali Network to T-Mobile eventually played out well as the OG AT&T had quite the 850MHz collection for Cali

VoiceStream aka T-Mobile was the first Nationwide GSM/GPRS network, and the last to launch HSPA due to misguided management in the mid 00s

So really, at&t only had maybe 1-2yrs heads on Verizon and that thunderbolt thing

Nope.

1) Blackberry did not have a 3G/HSPA phone until the Bold era, Wich was 2008ish - they were ALL edge up until that point. So NO simultaneous voice/data even possible

2) at&t did not start it's widespread HSPA rollout until 2006/2007. A vast majority of the AT&T/Cingular footprint was EDGE only. That was only fixed after 2007 because of the iPhone. So no simultaneous voice and data until then for 99% of people

3) EvDo was quite ahead of it's time. Cingular could never max out it's 200kbps theoretically max, moreless 1-3Mbps like EvDO. Verizon and Sprint made the right mobile broadband choice at the time

Samsung Sync in 2007 was the first UMTS phone Cingular really pushed

»www.cnet.com/reviews/sam ··· -review/

This was GPRS. It didn't even reach 40-50 kbps or so. This was pre-3G, I don't even know if you could call it "2G". You had to use a special modem program for it to even work with a virtual COM port over USB, and if I remember correctly having the feature at all was like $50 a month extra on the plans we got.

But I could be wrong about the simultaneous-ness of it. I believe I was able to pick up a call while on data, but the data would then "pause" besides a very basic keep-alive signal, and then "pick up" as soon as the call ended.

I do remember EvDo though.... I'm pretty sure my phone had that on the NEXT model I got....

In any case, maybe I am glorifying the past TOO much and my IT memories of long long nights in server rooms those days get a bit muddled.... but it seems to me I have been able to do data and voice at the same time for WELL over a decade.

I am not aware of any Class A GPRS devices that made its way into the majority public.

Class A being GPRS+GSM simultaneous attach and use.
Class B was the majority, with simultaneous attach but not use.

UMTS was the first true simultaneous voice and data network.

Also, the reason EvDO smoked EDGE (and GPRS for obvious reasons), was that EvDO was running on dedicated carriers, where as GRPS/EDGE were second class citizens shoved into unused time slots of the GSM carrier. So if lots of voice load, there are few time slots available for data.

All that throughput means next to nothing with the tiny cap making it practically useless. So you're screwed either way.