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WiMax 2 Preps For 2012 Launch
'Data rates that will leapfrog those of LTE'
The WiMax 2 standard, (802.16m) was predicted to be capable of delivering 120 Mbps downstream and 60 Mbps upstream by using a 4X2 MIMO antenna configuration with a single 20 MHz TDD channel -- though Samsung has also demonstrated a WiMax 2 system capable of 330 Mbps over short ranges. While technical details of the WiMax 2 standard are being finalized, and supporters say we'll see real-world commercialization of the technology in late 2011, you likely won't actually see WiMax 2 materialize until sometime in 2012. Then of course there's a serious question whether the two biggest WiMax supporters here in the States, Clearwire and Sprint, will be LTE providers (or in Clearwire's case, in existence) by the time WiMax 2 arrives.
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anon_40
@cox.net

anon_40

Anon

name

What would it be called? 5G or enchanced 4G
Gami00
join:2010-03-11
Mississauga, ON

Gami00

Member

Re: name

if it's out in 2012, it'll be 6g.. maybe 7g

Jim Kirk
Premium Member
join:2005-12-09
49985

Jim Kirk to anon_40

Premium Member

to anon_40
OG
gridlocked
join:2009-08-21
Bristol, RI

gridlocked

Member

Does It Really Matter?

Clear or whatever they are called this week has so many issues and their early lead in '4G' coverage is slipping fast.

I don't know anyone who has it in my area and they are 'built out' here if you can call it that. The coverage looks like a rejected piece of swiss cheese and the user reports of throttling and other issues don't paint a pretty picture.

If no deep pockets rescue is the in the works within the next year what are the odds of their survival?
xenophon
join:2007-09-17

xenophon

Member

Re: Does It Really Matter?

WiMAX isn't all about Clear, though true they have challenges funding the rollout completely. There are nearly 600 WiMAX deployments in about 150 countries, covering over 600m pops...

»wimaxforum.org/resources ··· y-report

WiMAX is here to stay. Cable and DSL both existed, so will LTE and WiMAX.
criggs
join:2000-07-14
New York, NY

criggs to gridlocked

Member

to gridlocked
said by gridlocked:

I don't know anyone who has it in my area and they are 'built out' here if you can call it that. The coverage looks like a rejected piece of swiss cheese

In Manhattan as well. I'd say that we are only about 60% covered, even though the official unveiling was on November 1st. In addition, within that coverage, I would say only about 30 to 40% shows up as indoor, or saturation, coverage. The majority of Manhattan coverage is outdoors ground level only.

I'm lucky enough to live in an apartment that is in an indoor spot, but if I walk less than a block in any direction pouf! I'm back to 3G.
said by gridlocked:

and the user reports of throttling and other issues don't paint a pretty picture.

I am aware of multiple such reports involving Clear customers. I am aware of very few such reports involving Sprint customers (although some on this forum have warned that we are too small to be a representative sample). Are you aware of any throttling reports from Sprint customers? I can say that I'm in a very busy metropolitan area (obviously!), I've had the service for almost three months, and have had no experience with throttling at all, and I'm a heavy user.
said by gridlocked:

If no deep pockets rescue is the in the works within the next year what are the odds of their survival?

Of equal importance to me is what happens if Clearwire goes belly up in the next six months. Yes, yes, yes, I know the odds don't favor that, fine. But let's set aside the odds for the moment and focus on the following question, if we could: If Clearwire goes down in the next six months, what happens to their WiMax network which Sprint uses? Is it turned off? Does Sprint 4G get turned off until they have LTE ready to roll instead? etc. etc.

Thanks for anyone who can shed some light on this.

jmn1207
Premium Member
join:2000-07-19
Sterling, VA

jmn1207

Premium Member

Re: Does It Really Matter?

Never had my Sprint 4G throttled either. I continuously listen to MOG subscription music for several hours and have the settings for it to stream 320 kbps mp3 files. Also, using the Slingmedia Player to watch TV, I have watched entire legs of the Tour de France, early golf rounds for major tournaments (6-8 hours!), and most recently, 2 college bowl games back to back without a hitch.

My office is located just north of and adjacent to the Dulles International Airport outside of DC.

The biggest question, if Wimax and Sprint 4G disappear within the next 6 months, is whether or not we would continue to have to pay the $10 "Premium Data Charge"?
talz13
join:2006-03-15
Avon, OH

talz13

Member

Re: Does It Really Matter?

said by jmn1207:

The biggest question, if Wimax and Sprint 4G disappear within the next 6 months, is whether or not we would continue to have to pay the $10 "Premium Data Charge"?

I would hope that I would instead end up with:
1. No $10 premium charge
2. A monthly $10 un-premium discount
tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY

tmc8080

Member

???

Where were those locations sold off by Verizon? Neglected by AT&T? Sold down the river by Comcast?
Mr Matt
join:2008-01-29
Eustis, FL

Mr Matt

Member

The duopoly twins could make WiMax successful!

If WiMax was supported by either of the duopoly twins things would be different. But since the big two have no interest in WiMax, the technology will probably languish even if it has attributes that make it superior to other technologies. Remember anything can be made to work if a sponsor throws enough money at it. WiMax 2 might be just the solution for rural area fixed radio systems.
vlad1000
join:2005-05-19
Brooklyn, NY

vlad1000

Member

i would wait for white spaces

all these mobile isp's are as useless as they are overpriced!!
their signal does not travel as far and does not permeate walls as well as white space broadband signal would...and either they're cheap and useless or expensive as hell and fast but still not omnipresent........
white space will be resolving all of these issues...the question is....shall any of us be alive to see it?:)
Sammer
join:2005-12-22
Canonsburg, PA

Sammer

Member

Re: i would wait for white spaces

If the FCC Chairman, AT&T Mobility, and Verizon Wireless have their way there won't be any white spaces. Why do you think they're so anxious to have another auction of TV Band spectrum as soon as possible? It's not about a bandwidth shortage (both AT&T and Verizon are sitting on AWS spectrum) it's about eliminating potential competition.

Selenia
Gentoo Convert
Premium Member
join:2006-09-22
Fort Smith, AR

Selenia to vlad1000

Premium Member

to vlad1000
I don't see how you find that white space will be the be all end all of things like wireless congestion issues and interference. VZ and AT&T already have good chunks of 700MHz spectrum, which penetrates walls very well, for use with LTE and such. The big 3 already use 850. Who uses it in your area depends. Otherwise, you might be on 1700/1900/2300 bands. I know AT&T and VZW have some nice 850 overlays around here, giving me up to 6/2 in my area on AT&T. VZ does well too, but is a victim of EVDO's technical limits. A local WISP that I help run does 5/1 or so to each customer without the 2 or 5GB cap, over several different bands, depending on neighborhood. I would hardly call that useless.
dynodb
Premium Member
join:2004-04-21
Minneapolis, MN

dynodb

Premium Member

Which is...

...the bigger form of vaporware- WiMax or broadband over power lines? Seems they've both been coming soon for the last 5 years.
talz13
join:2006-03-15
Avon, OH

talz13

Member

Re: Which is...

I get WiMax coverage at home, so I would have to say BPL is the bigger vaporware.

Jim Kirk
Premium Member
join:2005-12-09
49985

Jim Kirk to dynodb

Premium Member

to dynodb
said by dynodb:

...the bigger form of vaporware- WiMax or broadband over power lines? Seems they've both been coming soon for the last 5 years.

Uhh... For something to be vaporware, it has to not exist or be available for purchase.

iLive4Fusion
Premium Member
join:2006-07-13

iLive4Fusion

Premium Member

Re: Which is...

Isn't that Clearwire in most market's?

SimbaSeven
I Void Warranties
join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT
·StarLink

SimbaSeven to Jim Kirk

Member

to Jim Kirk
Well, BPL does exist.. if you want a large amount of interference in certain HF bands.

People can bitch about White Spaces. It does seem like a better alternative then trashing other bands. Why can't it receive the signal, then when it gets the information from the received stream it'll transmit the given frequency from the received information depending on how strong the received signal is.

I'm sure there are ways to make it better. I'm suspecting a cesspool of BS patents that is hindering the effort.

Selenia
Gentoo Convert
Premium Member
join:2006-09-22
Fort Smith, AR

Selenia to dynodb

Premium Member

to dynodb
Clear and Sprint will sell you a Wimax capable modem or phone right now. Hardly vaporware, even though whether you actually get Wimax depends on whether you live in its somewhat limited footprint. Wimax is also used by small WISPs. BPL wasn't vaporware either. It's just abandoned. Virginia, among a few other places, had live deployments. These deployments, however, were controversial due to interference issue, even after notching things like the ham radio bands was attempted. The company finally agreed with the public. That is that BPL was a waste of time and that several technologies are more viable for serving rural areas.
fiberguy2
My views are my own.
Premium Member
join:2005-05-20

fiberguy2 to dynodb

Premium Member

to dynodb
How about a 3rd option.. Qwest services. Their motto should be "What will we invent next... out of thin air"

Sorry, WiMax is up and running.. nice try with the trolling.

Oh, and now cue AT&T's "we're about to start to at some point think about maybe starting the latest new technology.. 4G" ... and they have that cute little 4g in the flame logo they used to launch 3G.

When will the telephone companies actually offer something instead of inventing new ways to charge for the same old crap? At least in this case I'll give Verizon some credit for actually trying to innovate and deliver.

Selenia
Gentoo Convert
Premium Member
join:2006-09-22
Fort Smith, AR

Selenia

Premium Member

Re: Which is...

said by fiberguy2:

When will the telephone companies actually offer something instead of inventing new ways to charge for the same old crap?

When consumers stop paying them so handsomely for the same old crap.
fiberguy2
My views are my own.
Premium Member
join:2005-05-20

fiberguy2

Premium Member

Re: Which is...

Well, at least on the number of customer losses in this area, I'd say that it's happening already.
decifal7
join:2007-03-10
Bon Aqua, TN

decifal7

Member

wonderful... just wonderful

Great another product to be taunted as the best and fastest.. The verizon commercials showing the idiot running outside after lightening struck a tree and grabbing the 4g device acting like he is about to take off would be more truthful if he grew in power and stomped around about three feet and fell over dead until the next months usage caps allowed him to be cool again..

Great product, poor pricing/use model..

Hopefully they will realize after they have "tested" their networks that more usage allowance before overages plowing would make it much more useful and popular.. Right now for the price you should have at least 50 gigs.. For the amount you get, you shouldn't be paying more than 15 a month imo.. It is just not that much data for a "professional" communication company to be charging too highly for..

membername
@208.3.69.x

membername

Anon

I welcome any kind of competition

I know everyone would prefer one competing standard. God knows it would make things easier.

But one thing we've Americans have always been is competitive. We need to get that compettive spirit back into our country again (regardless of political affiliation) even if that means having huge tech firms go toe to toe with competing standards.

If all we had was one technlology, one frequency band, one phone.... then all we'd wind up with is one BIG Verizon or one BIG AT&T. God knows we don't need to go that route again.

I say bring it on. Verizon needs some real competition.

The huge dark elephant in the room of course is funding. Right now Clear and Sprint aren't exactly riding high in cash.

Pushing WiMax 2 or jumping to LTE Advanced will require some serious $$$ / investor participation. I'd like to see DT throw their hat in the ring along with Clear and make an announcement of a new joint data venture that will create thousands of jobs and provide high speed mobile broadband to virtually all Americans.

I might be in a dream land but I think this country is ready for another high tech revolution.
firedrakes
join:2009-01-29
Arcadia, FL

firedrakes

Member

Re: I welcome any kind of competition

really dont care till i see real world test not guess how fast it goes
decifal7
join:2007-03-10
Bon Aqua, TN

decifal7 to membername

Member

to membername
We might see another high tech revolution if the companies don't unite on pricing like they apparently did with 3g. Similar price, similar caps.. Sprint did eventually pretend to be unlimited, but you have too many still be complacent to really help the competition.
88615298 (banned)
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness

88615298 (banned)

Member

It's all BS

I don't care who is pushing 4G or whatever they call it. As long as they insist and meager caps and heavy overages it's bullshit.

Heity
@comcast.net

Heity

Anon

Google should buy clear and upgrade it to wimax 2

I think this would be a wonderful solution. It would compliment their fibre network, then continue to sell wholesale to sprint and maybe other smaller telecoms that could emerge.

hdtvtechno22
join:2008-08-22
Chicago, IL

hdtvtechno22

Member

Hold on

Clear needs to fix the dead spots first
fiberguy2
My views are my own.
Premium Member
join:2005-05-20

fiberguy2

Premium Member

Re: Hold on

said by hdtvtechno22:

Clear needs to fix the dead spots first

Ain't that the truth!

Not to mention, it's rather funny how technology seems to shrink as it "expands"..

take the ATT network.. you can get EDGE/2G almost everywhere. With in those areas where there is 3G speeds, the coverage area is smaller than 2G. And as 4g comes out, it will be even smaller than 3G. I'm waiting for 5G and 6G service (which by the way, all these G's are getting old - can't wait for 20G) which will basically be so small that the entire city will have to stand in the central park to get it.
chgo_man99
join:2010-01-01
Sunnyvale, CA

chgo_man99

Member

BPL

I don't see how it works. I tried to turn my electrical wiring in my apartment into LAN and it was not optimal. High jittery, high latency...
sonicmerlin
join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH

sonicmerlin

Member

Wha...

I thought WIMAX 2 was supposed to achieve fixed speeds of 1 gbps down, satisfying true 4G requirements?